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I noticed recently how quietly mixed the "Prototypes" cue is in the movie. Weird considering that Nolan usually likes the music to be loud (as Hans himself said in a Q&A session once). A shame, cause it's a neat cue and you can barely hear it.
For those, like me, who are wondering how much of Batmobile Chase was really Lorne Balfe's creative genius, listen to the "Final Confrontation" cue (the one right before Train Fight). If Hans did that cue, then we can know Batmobile Chase is at least 95% Zimmer, even if Lorne Balfe TECHNICALLY arranged it.
Hybrid has said a billion times that such a thing is impossible. We know the following:
Ramin Djawadi was involved with Training and Lasiurus Lorne Balfe was involved with Batmobile Chase and Backup Mel Wesson did the ambient material in the score And then the James Newton Howard contributions are, generally, rather obvious. But he uses a lot of HZ material and style throughout the score, so it's not black and white.
Yeah. Plus, Hybrid posted a list of cues that JNH was "in charge of" just below this thread.
Sorry, didn't know the detailed history. :)
Was Vespertilio re-used in DKR?
Well, not exactly like that....It's the main theme throughout the films, so it popped up essentially at various points, but the closest thing to it being used directly in TDKR was the Hospital Visit cue.
hybrid, zimmer wrote the theme used in training right? because he used that theme again in tdk and there was no ramin credit.
This is something I wondered myself as well. Cause if Ramin really wrote that theme (as opposed to just arranging it after Hans wrote it), he basically wrote the most important theme out of the trilogy (and the theme which made the endings of TDK and TDKR so memorable).
In Kung Fu Panda, certain ghostwriters would be involved with each specific composer (Paul Mounsey did cues for Powell while Lorne did cues for Zimmer, for example). Was it similar here? Like, if Ramin Djawadi did some cues, they were for Zimmer, not Howard?
Does anyone know where is the music on this complete score when Batman first meets Gordon ("you're a good cop , one of the few") and has to escape from the police station? Thank you
The cue, called Batman Visits Gordon, is missing, like a few others : Courthouse Pt 2, Finch Is Killed & a part of Fight In Crane's Lab...
As for JNH's involvement, though crediting is quite hard cause the basic material for the score was written by both Hans & James, but I can tell you that he was "in charge" of :
Father To The Rescue Campfire Your System Is Broken Hide In The Dark Initiation Into League Temple Fight Return To Gotham Crane Warns Rachel The Bat Cave Wayne Enterprises Prototypes Batman Visits Gordon Dockyard Ambush Pt1 Meeting Rachel Microwave Stolen Fox Is Fired Surveying The Ruins
I miss a few, but you can certainly add to that cues like Finders Keepers Pt 1, Your Father's Name, Bruce Left For Dead.
That doesn't really seem like he did nothing... ;)
Thank you for your answer Hybrid:) So that means the track 25. Batman Visits Gordon (1:12)included on some bootlegs contains FX?
Yes they generally are DVD rips.
Thank you for the information Hybrid :) Strangely I was sure the music from "Batman visits Gordon" was originally on the official soundtrack : my bad :)
Not in Begins but in TDK's OST in "I'm Not A Hero", there's an almost identical reprise of it in it... :P
Are you sure about Initiation Into League/Bruce Left for Dead/Dockyard Ambush Pt. 1/The Bat Cave?
I don't mean to question you, but those sure sound a lot like Zimmer tracks to me. It'd be fascinating otherwise.
Thanks for all the info, Hybrid. Like I said down below, trying to prove people wrong, Hans wrote the majority, JNH did the rest.
Now I have to agree with Cheesy, is "The Batcave" REALLY JNH? I know you have your sources Hybrid, but that's got Zimmer's main 2-note Batman theme in it, finishing off the track. I could swear it's Zimmer. But I'm not doubting you
there are no missing parts Hybrid, those cues exist. I have those cues, and they are not dvd-rips
Ya, I happen to have those "missing cues" as well, and they're genuine 320kbps. Clean, no DVD rip
Wat? Since when? Did I miss this party?
You really think that if these famous "missing cues" were available , FX free , genuine or anything you prefer , they would not be included in the HZ.com BB tracklist? DVD rips! that's all FAKE!
Regarding JNH and the Bat Cave: are you ABSOLUTELY sure that was Howard? Your System is Broken also sounded heavily "Zimmer" to me. I mean, you're the boss, but...
Oh shoot, I feel annoying. Two people said the same thing above.
JNH said he had a stronger presence in the first half of the film and Zimmer had a stronger presence in the second half, so those credits up there actually make some form of sense, even if JNH used Zimmer's themes a lot.
I know this has no real basis, but if I had to guess which tracks were Zimmer based on Hybrid's list of Howard stuff, I would say Zimmer was "in charge of":
Young Bruce Falls The Long Walk Training Why Bats? Gordon at Home Batman On Fire Finders Keepers pt. 2 Fight in Crane's Lab (all parts) Back Up (yes I know Lorne arranged this one) Batmobile chase Batman Arrives All the final fight music Danger Over Gordon Says Thanks
I honestly think this is one of the best scores ever written. Proof of this comes from the fact that it's been copied by every action film and movie trailer since 2005. It's just a genius piece of work and fits the movie perfectly.
You have a really bizarre idea of what "proof" is. The score is copied because Batman Begins and The Dark Knight were successful and revolutionized superhero movies in general. Now every director wants their films to be like Nolan's films and that includes music that sounds like Zimmer.
This reminds me: can anyone tell me why these scores contain cues as originally recorded, but not the final film versions also/instead (like Backup)?
If I had to guess, I would say the purpose of the cue sheet is to determine what goes where...Not to document all the music written/used, necessarily...I dunno. It is a shame, though. The film version of Backup is intense.
Speaking of Backup, I find it really interesting that even though Lorne Balfe arranged the cue, we now know:
--what Backup would sound like if Lorne were totally in charge of it (the cue on his site) --what Backup would sound like if whoever the music mixer was had his way with Lorne's cue (the film version) --and now, what Backup would sound like if Hans Zimmer was in charge: 1:10-2:43 in "Imagine the Fire"!
Mmmhhh honestly, I think that, though Lorne has Backup on his website, he only arranged some HZ suite/material. For me Backup is 100% HZ, but Lorne was asked to arrange the cue to the picture. The same way there's this long HZ "Wayne Manor" suite from TDKR that was arranged to the picture by other team members.
It seems slightly unfair to me to compare Backup to TDKR's score. Because with TDKR's score, the material from the suites is hardly changed at all. For example, pretty much all the Bane music heard in the movie, or cues like "Blake Visits Wayne Manor", "Take Me to Bane", "Not Meant to Die Here", "He Was the Batman", "No Stone Unturned"--whether or not they were arranged by Hans, they appear in the film exactly as Hans wrote them in his suites. Thus, it truly is 100% Hans.
But something about Backup feels like more than JUST an arrangement of pre-existing themes. As much as Lorne borrowed from existing thematic material, it seems to be far more "original" than the cues from TDKR and Lorne truly deserves to call it his.
@Hybrid (or anyone else capable) Do you think we could get a track list/log for which composers wrote which cues, like we got with TDK? I've always wondered whether it was HZ or JNH who wrote the music for Ra's Al Ghul.
Yes, I second this! Please Hybrid, please!
I'm pretty sure the Ra's al Ghul theme was JNH.
I remember that once Hybrid had made a credits list for the OST and the Lasiurus track (which is the Ra’s Al Ghul Suite) was written by JNH.
Actually after I asked, I was told Djawadi did work on Lasiurus. Did he write it all ? Arrange it ? No idea, but he surely was on it.
What's the probability of this score seeing an official expanded release like the second movie got?
Rather low, m'friend. Hans Zimmer scores almost never get expanded releases. Hans himself isn't big into those, for some reason (he would do well to learn from Lorne Balfe in that regard... :P). The only reason The Dark Knight got an extended release was because the movie was so immensely popular and that would give the studio even more money. I assume the same can be said for the upcoming Man of Steel album: either the studio is convinced that the film will make a lot of money, and so releasing more music is worth it, or Water Tower had grat sales with The Hobbit's score.
Either way, I wouldn't hold out for a Batman Begins "official" expanded release short of divine intervention. Though believe me, I'd be quite happy if such a thing happened.
Actually, HZ isn't "against" the idea... Trust me if there's one who would like to see mixes of TLK, TTRL or Black Hawk Down released, it's him !
The problem is he doesn't really have time to give to the past, it's always "the next project" and it never ends.
I wish he would pass it on to someone else to do. I'm sure someone at RCP would love to be given a unique project like that. I know I would haha.
Interesting...Well, maybe one day he'll be able to take a break like John Powell is doing and get stuff like this rolling.
I concur, Anonymous. I love hearing that Hans Zimmer will be scoring a film, but there are a lot of "blossoming" talents at RCP who would probably appreciate the chance to do whole scores and not just additional music/arrangements.
I don't suppose there are any petitions for a two-disc BB soundtrack floating around, are there? :P
Do petitions work for this kinda thing?
Actually, if I'm remembering correctly, I believe it was a petition that got the first Transformers score released (and that was an excellent album if you ask me!).
The CD was always planned. Like Armageddon, just very bad timing...
Yes, the Transformers score was planned from the very beginning, and it was decided to have it released at the same time as the DVD. Not knowing that, many people got pissed, and started a (useless) petition.
Well, okay then. No hope for an expanded Begins release, I guess.
This has to be my favorite score of this trilogy. There was a mysterious quality to it that the others lacked. Maybe it was because it used the two-note theme a lot, which Zimmer said "almost had a question" in it.
You said you couldn't give the credits for this score since the main stuff was written by both Hans and James, with Hans sometimes using James' stuff and James sometimes using Hans' stuff. You said, though, that you could give the credits for TDK since it's more clear-cut.
However, TDK has quite a bit of temp music in it (LSI Extraction is Batman Visits Gordon, Trip to Hong Kong is Preparing Equipment, You're Gonna Love Me is part of Fight in Crane's Lab)...SO THE QUESTION, THEN, is this: if you can say who composed the temp music in TDK, can you say who composed the same thing in Begins or not?
Something I find interesting about this score is the lack of theme suite material on CD3 (besides Ra's Al Ghul and Batman Theme). It's mostly alternate cues. Speaking of which, it seems we got the alternate version of Batmobile Chase on the album. I wonder why.