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Fox Three you right mate,i love all of this soundtrack,Lorne Balfe and Hans Zimmer did a good job.Soap,Price,Ghost etc. memourable team,good scenario,best graphics and this soundtracks.This game and this soundtrack will not be forgotten.R.I.P. Simon Ghost Riley.And the gulag scene ohh my god !Hey Hybrid, is Jeff still with RCP? I just read a review of his new score for an Indian movie named "Veeram".Hybrid, it's been a while since somebody asked but in Dead Man's Chest there are 18 missing cues on a grand total of 15 minutes. In At World's End there are 2 missing cues of gramd total of 5 minutes.<br><br>My question is if you know if they are ever going to be released??<br>Thanks very muchSame here!!<br>Loved that score and prefer it to lego batman. The main theme is cool, and there's an "out-of-nowhere" throwback to the 90s in the cue "barfmitzvah", what can I ask more??Not bad! The "Love" cue has great orchestral moments. At least *** score after the first listen.
Conrad Pope was here? That's surprising!Great score, love the action cues and the constant use of main theme in different variations throughout the whole score. Honestly I prefer this one over the Lego Batman soundtrack...Moonlight also reminds me of parts of Chappie!Oh yeah it's great, Moonlight In Vermont even has Beckett's Death from POTC 3 !Thanks
Wow! I thought I recognized the name of the channel. Awesome dude. Thank you so much.Thank you.Yeah, Dimitris, it was your channel. Thanks man! :)Where do you listen to this guys? In my channel? I have the album in my channel.And in the Track 4 isn't that a bit of Inception?
Yo dude. Thanks for pointing this out. Listening to it now. Sounds excellent.Holy shit. So I just listened to this album on YouTube and it's FANTASTIC. So much 80s cheeseball fun. And the first track even has the riff in it that would go on to become the First Born theme and then, later on, way way way down the road, 160 BPM from Angels & Demons. It's really incredible how distinct Hans' voice is even as early as 1983. As much as I enjoy the vocals, I'd kill to get instrumental versions of some of these songs.Sure, pal.<br><br>Blue female troops theme (heard in "Nameless Order")<br>Great Wall theme ("What a Wall")<br>William's theme ("The Great Wall")<br>Tao Tei (monsters) theme (first heard in "First Battle")<br>Tovar's guitar motif (briefly heard in "First Battle")<br><br>These are the most prominent/identifiable ones.Just a few of the cuesheet titles from ASCAP if anyone is interested, not sure if it's the whole thing (And not in order)<br><br>INFERNO MAIN TITLE THEME<br>ZOBRIST AND SIENNA LOVE PT 1<br>ZOBRIST AND SIENNA LOVE PT 2<br>DECIPHER<br>TED TALK<br>ISTANBUL PT 1-6<br>ARRIVE IN VENICE / ESCAPE CHURCH PT 1-6<br>THE CISTERN <br>VASARI PAINTING PT 1-4<br>BOCHARD / DECYPHER IMAGE PT 1-4<br>LANGDON CHECKS HIS EMAIL PT 1<br>LANGDON CHECKS HIS EMAIL PT 2<br>THE MASK IS MISSING PT 1-6<br>IN FLORENCE PT 1-3<br>ESCAPE TRAIN PT 1<br>ESCAPE TRAIN PT 2<br>TUBE OPENED / FARADAY PROJECTION PT 1-3<br>EMPLOYMENT OF A MAD MAN PT 1-3<br>ESCAPE TO ATTIC PT 1-3<br>MASK RECOVERED PT 1<br>MASK RECOVERED PT 2<br>DANTES MASK/INFERNO END TITLE THEME<br>INFERNO END TITLE THEME PT 2<br>Can anybody give me a list of the names of themes and motifs in the movie. I would appreciate it.
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Hans ZimmerBenjamin WallfischCzarina RussellBob Badami
ComposerAdditional MusicScore CoordinatorMusic Supervisor
12 Years A Slave (Complete Score)
Label: Promotional Release
Length: 38'48
HZimmer.com rating:        Not yet rated
Fans rating:     rate at 1 out of 5 rate at 2 out of 5 rate at 3 out of 5 rate at 4 out of 5 rate at 5 out of 5   2/5 (3107 votes)
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  1. Solomon Northup (1:55)
  2. Main Title (0:28)
  3. Bedtime (1:35)
  4. Arrival In Washington (0:24)
  5. Solomon In Chains (5:03)
  6. Preparing For Travel (1:00)
  7. Boat Trip To New Orleans (5:14)
    Hans Zimmer, Benjamin Wallfisch
  8. Saragota Flashback (2:12)
  9. River Rafting Claps (1:05)
  10. Eliza Flashback (1:45)
  11. Escape Sequence (1:32)
  12. Time Passing Sequence (1:32)
  13. Devasted Crops (0:51)
  14. Plantation Life (Part A) (0:59)
  15. Plantation Life (Part B) (0:56)
  16. Judge Yarney's Ball (1:10)
  17. Letter Writing (0:52)
  18. Solomon Burns The Letter (1:06)
  19. Soap (3:38)
  20. A Free Man (2:12)
  21. Nothing To Forgive - End Credits (3:32)
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Frank reply Replies: 0 || 2016-11-17 07:17:20
So I attend this discussion with Benjamin and he said the score of Hidden Figures has choirs and almost covers 80% of the film. So I guess there will be a score album for it? Any news Hybrid?

badbu reply Replies: 7 || 2014-01-14 15:53:46
mhh...don't like the score.
wtf is "escape sequence"? :D


Mortifer V.2014-01-15 00:11:24
:D


badbu2014-01-15 08:07:19
i thought my "bose" system is broken :D
what a track :D


Samuel Jacob2016-10-07 00:10:37
How come it wont let me download?


Edmund Meinerts2016-10-07 12:22:06
Because it's doing you a favor (this score suuuuuuuuucks).


Frank2016-10-07 13:41:34
It's called avant-garde music. Obviously this score paid homage to lost of contemporary composers like John Cage, Arvo Part, Steve Reich and so on.


Edmund Meinerts2016-10-07 16:34:26
I know what it's called; doesn't mean I have to like it. ;)

(And where you're hearing Part in this, I don't know...)


Frank2016-10-08 06:08:05
Yeah you can say you don't like it but this score is anything but "sucks". As for Arvo Part, listen to Bedtime and tell me it's not tintinnabuli.

trent easton navarro reply Replies: 14 || 2014-01-16 15:28:07
No oscar nomination for Zimmer (nor Jackman thank god)
Surprised that Rush is ignored for all major categories though


SanAntonioSpurs2014-01-16 15:59:28
I'm very sad. :(


MacArthur2014-01-16 16:16:36
12 Years a slave wasn't nominated?

I thought that was what the FYC was for?


isildur2014-01-16 16:34:30
I don't even get what the academy wants, Rush was a superb movie with great performances, stunning visuals, superbly edited and directed and all around an awesome movie.

I thought Daniel Bruhl would get nominated, his performance was absolutely great and what about the score? It was Hans' best this year. I don't mind Hans not getting nominated for 12 Years..but he should have been nominated for Rush. This is absurd. They ignored Rush like it's nothing.

Has anyone heard "Her" score? How is it? It got nominated for the best score? I listened to all others in the list except this.


MacArthur2014-01-16 17:00:08
Probably awful. The Academy has no idea how to work things they have to be "Politically correction" To heck with that crap.


MacArthur2014-01-16 17:00:47
Politically Correct.*


thejok3rrules2014-01-16 17:27:26
The fact they ommited Daniel Bruhl from getting nominated makes me angry as hell! I had the felling they would ignore the movie as a whole, but this particular performance deserves not only to be nominated, but to win! Goddamn Academy.


Ds2014-01-16 17:43:43
isildur, you're absolutely right in everything you said. Rush was a perfect movie from start to finish, this is the kind of movie the Academy should show as an example of filmmaking, and inspiration for filmmakers.

But sadly the movie opened in September and didn't make big numbers at the box office, so there's not enough hype left...


MacArthur2014-01-16 18:07:20
Rush didn't get the numbers at the box office because of the films content.


Spence2014-01-16 19:25:08
I agree Rush's score should have been included in the Oscars, definitely would have replaced Saving Mr. Banks with it. But the other scores are brilliant in ever way. Gravity, Her The book thief, and Phillomena. Fantastic scores that all deserve to do there.

Yes this is a Zimmer fan page, but dont let it skewer how you perceive non Remote Conteol prod scores/composers.


Edmund Meinerts2014-01-16 19:36:31
Interesting that you'd kick out Saving Mr. Banks. I liked that score a lot, it's the most straightforwardly beautiful music we've heard from Thomas Newman in a long time, kind of a throwback to his great scores in the 90s. In fact, of the nominees, I think I want that one to win the most.

If I had to kick one score out (to replace with Rush, if you want...although personally I'd put in Desolation of Smaug), then probably Philomena, which is absolutely nothing special by Desplat's standards. He's covered that kind of musical ground much more memorably in the past.

I haven't heard Her and I don't believe there's a score album released, so I can't pass judgment on that one. Seems like the "stunt nominee" of the year.


Zimson2014-01-16 19:40:18
Rush is an action movie (and score) and action movies almost never get nominated for an Oscar. LA Times found out that the average age of the jury is 62! That explains a lot.


MacArthur2014-01-16 19:41:10
Watch that one will probably win. Lol.


RealFfingMusic2014-03-06 05:54:37
Absolutely right, Zimson.

"Batman"s and "Transformer"s (Jablonsky) didn't get even nominated either.
And "Rush" was totally fantastic.

Although "12 Years a Slave" used the same cue over and over again, it is also excellent.


MacArthur2014-03-06 16:31:05
Agreed I really liked 12 years score. It was very peaceful and moving.

Solomon Northup reply Replies: 2 || 2014-03-05 16:56:48
Kudos to Hans and the webmasters for putting up that picture of Steve McQueen with his Oscar for Best Picture :)


RealFfingMusic2014-03-06 05:51:02
absolutely right, Zimson.

Nolan's Batmans and Transformers (Jablonsky) didn't get even nominated either.
And Rush was totally fantastic.


RealFfingMusic2014-03-06 05:52:50
Sorry. this goes on the thread below. :)
I like the McQueen pic too.

Anonymous reply Replies: 2 || 2014-01-13 02:03:45
Best of luck at the Golden Globes tonight Hans! Here's wishing you a win!!


Frank2014-01-13 04:44:09
Someone names Alex Ebert won it...Seriously, who is he? I thought Zimmer or Steven Price would win


Spence2014-01-14 06:24:02
Woah Frank, don't beat on a guy just because you don't know who he is. Price is an extremely new composer too, you know.

While, I still think Price should have taken it, Ebert's score is beautiful and brilliant. Very unique asthetic for a film score, highly deserving of an award. Also it is the Golden Globes, so......... hold your complaint until the oscars ;)

Ds reply Replies: 35 || 2014-01-08 12:47:53
BAFTA nominations: "12 Years A Slave" and "Captain Phillips" both nominated for best original music. Congratulations to Zimmer and Jackman!

... but it's still pretty hilarious.


isildur2014-01-08 13:34:18
Not just pretty, it's like ROFL hilarious :D
Idiots, not nominating RUSH.


Edmund Meinerts2014-01-08 17:12:58
Nomination by proxy. It's The Social Network all over again.


thejok3rrules2014-01-08 17:33:30
The Social Nework deserved to win, but I prefered Inception that year.


MacArthur2014-01-08 18:14:39
Are you kidding the social network sucked as a score.


Ds2014-01-08 18:38:20
Social Network was a brilliant movie with a ... hum... particular score. But this score was made by someone so famous that the Academy decided to be blown away.


thejok3rrules2014-01-08 20:03:31
In my opinion, it deserved it, and I personaly loved it too! But everyone has its own opinion, I'm just sharing mine :p


MacArthur2014-01-08 20:33:44
And So you can. I'm Saying I hated the Score.


Edmund Meinerts2014-01-08 21:20:17
In a year that produced something as incredible as How to Train Your Dragon, a score like The Social Network has no business even being nominated. Like I said, it won by proxy: "hey, this was a pretty good movie but we gave all our major awards away, hmm, what's left...how about Best Score? And the music is by a famous guy. It MUST be good!"


thejok3rrules2014-01-08 22:16:30
I have to agree on that: HTTYD was the best score that year, without any doubt...


A nun, a moose2014-01-08 22:19:08
Hey MacArthur. Can you give us point by point every reason for why you disliked The Social Network score?


trent easton navarro2014-01-08 23:06:13
It wasn't written by Hans Zimmer or Steve Jablonsky, that's why macarthur didn't like the social network :P

Anyway on topic, both nominations are laughable, especially Captain Phillips. Of the five nominated scores, only Newman's is the real deserved one.


Zimson2014-01-08 23:28:28
Trent, what are you even doing here? This is supposed to be a "fan site".


Mike2014-01-08 23:31:22
Zimson, he's said this before: he IS a fan of Zimmer, and can point out scores of his that he really likes. What he isn't a fan of (from what I gather) is the modern Zimmer sound. Though I'll let him answer you. ;)


Ds2014-01-09 00:31:58
Trent: this is true that Powell should have won. God, an Oscar for his best score yet, how incredible it would have been!!

But regarding this year, i have to disagree with you, i think Gravity should (and will) win best original score. It's an astonishing work, not entirely "musical" in the classical sense, but really groundbreaking in terms of what a score can bring to a movie.


Russel2014-01-09 00:34:28
Gravity doesn't even have an FYC CD, not that that matters for awards. But, just found that quite curious. They sent to the academy members, a sealed OST soundtrack CD. Nothing special..


Anonymous2014-01-09 03:56:08
Interesting discussion, on several fronts.

In terms of the Oscars that year, I'm still astonished why Inception was not the winner. In my mind, it was far superior to all other nominations, mostly because of its profound nature -- considerably inventive, excellently conceived, and a perfect compliment to an superb film.

Ds: that raises another point -- I wonder how many voting members of the Academy consider their vote on the basis of the score as experienced with the film, or as a separate listening experience.

Newman has a solid contribution this year with Mr. Banks. Frankly, it's time either Hans or Thomas gets a win. Both are so deserving. I was as shocked about Inception not winning as I was Newman's The Green Mile.



MacArthur2014-01-09 05:17:35
The Social Network was to Techno and Synth were blazing everywhere Nothing Melodic or Action in the score (Not saying action is the only merit, I love Driving miss Daisy, Nine Months,) It just had no real melody.


A nun, a moose2014-01-09 05:28:26
^ ... oh god.


MacArthur2014-01-09 06:03:54
What? Did it have a melody.


A nun, a moose2014-01-09 07:24:10
Yes.

You need to expand your definition of melody.


NM2014-01-09 09:10:03
The social network just sucked as both a listening experience and did nothing to enhance the film (in my opinion).

The 'Captain Phillips' nomination is utterly ridiculous and makes me question if anyone even listened to the score. I remember going to that film and thinking it was great and the only negative talking point I had afterwards was that it felt a bit generic because of the music.

'Saving Mr Banks' and 'The Book Thief' both worthy inclusions. I loved the former in particular, a really bright, fun, pointy score. But I may be biased because I was't expecting the film to be crap and fell in love with it. 'Gravity' is meh. The music didn't ruin the film but it added little to it in my opinion, and there were points it sounded like a generic trailer.

Haven't heard '12 years a slave' yet.


trent easton navarro2014-01-09 10:38:50
@Zimson Like Mike said, I am indeed a fan of Zimmer. Together with Goldsmith and Horner he was the first composer that I really loved and that got me to explore film music back in the 90's. Unlike some here though, I don't love every score just cause it says " music composed by Hans Zimmer".
But I must say, last year was Hans' best year in quite some time. Both The Lone Ranger and Rush were great and Man of Steel was enjoyable (horrible film though as was it's use of the score).
And of course another reason to come here is to read the ridiculous musings of MacArthur. That stuff is comedy gold man :P


marco2014-01-09 13:32:55
@Ds

i completely agree with your thoughts on gravity. i honestly have to say if it was scored in a more traditional way the movie wouldn't have had the same affect on me. Because there wasn't much going on (sound effect wise) the score truly played a major part of the movie, more than a score usually does. Steven Price certainly hit the nail on the head for this one and i really hope it wins.


trent easton navarro2014-01-09 14:31:28
For me, the Gravity score lacked something. It was solid, did what it needed to do but overall I couldn't connect with it. I think someone like John Murphy could have done a much better job.

Same goes for Captain Phillips, another great film with an unremarkable score. In the film the score is ok, but imagine of Powell had scored that one!


MacArthur2014-01-09 16:34:59
Trent you didn't Think That Dark knight rises was good?

I I don't like music just because it says " music composed by Hans Zimmer".
Not A huge fan of Sherlock Holmes (Granted it was Original) but still it didn't do much I mean I like it ok but it's not my favorite. POTC4 wasn't great Pirates stuff I liked (Mermaids, Guilty of being innocent, Mutiny, end Credits, Blackbeard, too be precise) but the other stuff sucked. I like 12 years a slave but I don't think It's Academy award worthy. see my point.


marco2014-01-09 17:01:00
@trent

It's funny that you mention john Murphy, I actually thought he scored the movie when I heard some untagged samples.
Only if john Powell would have scored it. Saddens me to think he could have been there to compose for it. But I will save my expectations for httyd 2 considering he hasn't scored anything for a while.


MacArthur2014-01-09 17:05:06
Just remembered this I know everyone will hate this I don't care for Now we are free from Gladiator.

@ Thx for the remark on me being a comedian, I like making people laugh.:)


Zimson2014-01-09 19:12:26
@Trent
Ok. I consider myself a fan of his works from 2006 and onwards, not all, but most of them. I do like The Lion King and Gladiator, they are classics, but I have to say Zimmer is on his best today and I hope he doesn't stop delivering this quality. I rarely listen to filmmusic, but I know several classics and I have to say Hans brought orchestral music to a new level like, for example Stravinsky did. Scores like Crimson Tide, Dark Knight or Inception just show his brilliance. Who else would have come up with something like the joker theme? Yeah, I feel like the worst kind of fanboy right now. :D


MacArthur2014-01-09 19:59:08
Don't hate not the biggest fan of the Lion King either.


trent easton navarro2014-01-09 20:55:30
@MacArthur Didn't really care for TDKR, for me it was too much a rehash of the first two scores and offered nothing really new. To be honest, wasn't a real big fan of the first Batman score. The Dark Knight was pretty cool though. Overall not a big fan of Nolan/Zimmer films, but that has more to do with Nolan than Zimmer. Whereas Ridley Scott, Gore Verbinksy and Ron Howard bring out the best Zimmer, Nolan brings out the worst.

@Zimson Interesting, from 2006 was the moment I started losing interest in Zimmer. For me, Zimmer's golden period is from early 90's to early 00's And yeah, you kinda sound like the ultimate fanboy :P Then again, I'd probably sound the same when I talk about Jerry Goldsmith


MacArthur2014-01-09 21:03:56
Funny I think that Chris nolan brings out the best in Zimmer, Howard does a good job too. Verbinski with the pirates's scores was great, all but the last one.

Speaking of Goldsmith do you like his Star Trek score for the motion picture.


trent easton navarro2014-01-09 21:55:58
For me Nolan doesn't know how to use music in his films. The ones scored by Julyan are even worse. My fave Verbinski/Zimmer score is The Ring. One of the best horror scores of the last 10 years.

yeah man, i love Goldsmith's original Star Trek score! Great theme, exciting action cues.That man knew how to score a film. No matter how terrible the film, Goldsmith usually always delivered the goods.


Mike2014-01-09 22:22:48
POTC4 wasn't a Verbinski film, MacArthur. There's part of your answer. ;)


Magnus Rex2014-01-10 00:36:47
@Trent - totally with you on The Ring. Beautiful work, so understated and a perfect fit.


MacArthur2014-01-10 06:24:39
Yes the Ring is Good.

I didn't know Verbinski didn't do the last one, interesting.

SanAntonioSpurs reply Replies: 2 || 2014-01-08 23:37:24
This is not complete score.. a few missing track.. example: To be hung on the tree Solomon Northup - braamm!!! track missing.


Edmund Meinerts2014-01-08 23:43:36
Oh no! A missing braaammm! Whatever shall we do?!?


Mike2014-01-08 23:50:42
Edmund, we shall rejoice for the sake of our ears, that's what we shall do. ;)

MacArthur reply Replies: 0 || 2014-01-08 20:54:00
If You enjoy the Star Spangled Banner, Look this up Brokencastiron 3 girls singing Star Spangled Banner on youtube

Hybrid Soldier reply Replies: 20 || 2013-12-13 15:10:42
If someone finds a proper scan of the cover, let me know... lol


Mike2013-12-13 15:21:47
I'm curious to know how many cues Benjamin Wallfisch did. I imagine not that many.


Anonymous2013-12-13 15:24:39
I say it is probably entirely Wallfisch.


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-13 15:35:02
Wallfisch wrote a fair amount.


Mike2013-12-13 16:24:31
How close to half? Do you know?


SanAntonioSpurs2013-12-13 16:32:42
Hybrid I find - i.imgur.com/AdBPHf0.jpg


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-13 16:33:37
Thanks but I'd love the original one, not "almost the same done by fans" ! :D


And Mike I really can't say...


Edmund Meinerts2013-12-13 17:27:12
Can't say as in don't know, or can't say as in not allowed? ;)


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-13 18:09:32
Both ? :P


Mike2013-12-13 21:47:45
It seems highly unlikely to me that Wallfisch did "most" of this one, addressing Anonymous' comment. It's a 40 minute score and Hans seems proud of it, and he talks about it a lot, but how could he be proud of it reasonably if he only wrote, say, 15 min?


Ds2013-12-13 22:48:44
... and most of the 40' are just slight variations of a same, simple theme. If Wallfisch did most of it... it would mean Hans didn't do anything of it. I can't believe that, as Mike said, he seems very proud of this score.


0-cool2013-12-13 23:39:19
boat trip is really awesome. Very unusual and inventive
Bedtime is lovely


12072013-12-14 00:29:00
cover ;) farm4.staticflickr.com/3675/11352085274_9587900297.jpg


Sharon2013-12-17 12:41:34
Any buddy, realize that Soap is so similar to TIME... i am serious.


Pgrs2013-12-18 18:22:07
"Any buddy, realize that Soap is so similar to TIME... i am serious."

Fucking TRUE!!


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-22 10:22:55
Finally the original cover... lol


Mortifer V.2013-12-22 14:55:49
was kinda expecting a better use of fonts. well I had to do this: bit.ly/1a1ynZR


Marc2013-12-22 16:03:30
Nice cover Hybrid, can you provide us a full-res. please. :)


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-22 16:06:01
Nope sorry it's all I've got... -_-


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-23 09:50:40
I added a high res, thanks Gavin ! :)


Marc2013-12-24 20:20:37
Thanks Hybrid for the full-res. Merry Christmas ^^

thejok3rrules reply Replies: 50 || 2013-12-13 21:11:11
''River Rafting Claps'' and ''Escape Sequence'' might be the must useless thing Zimmer has ever done... Overall it is good, but I feel the ''Time'' ripoff now... If this wins an Oscar, I'd be happy for Hans, but Rush is by far his best score this year.


Mortifer V.2013-12-22 17:14:47
Dunno if Rush is his best this year, but yeah, it is definitely better than 12 Years A Slave.


MacArthur2013-12-22 17:41:44
MoS was great, 9.5 out of 10
Rush was great 9 out of 10
Lone Ranger was good 9 out of 10
12 years was about a 6 out of 10, Maybe 7. :)


maximus2013-12-22 18:48:38
maccy boy, you clearly need to rethink your passion for film music. MOS was an average piece of score writing. it was epic yes but too epic. but epic does not always mean good. there was way too much information all at once. where i would say rush and the lone ranger were far superior to mow especially rush, 12 years a slave was 80% the same theme all the way through in different variations and mark my words, it WILL NOT WIN an oscar. it was nominated purely because of the movie. i really do love Hans Zimmer, but this is a composer who has not written on paper for over 10 years, which is extremely talented to do this but is also very limited in which you can process your ideas. Im a self taught musician, and cannot read music. i passed my grade 1 and 2 piano just by learning the test off my teacher by hear. i failed on the random piece of music i was given at the end of the test. Obviously this has nothing to do with what I'm talking about but its where i am going with this. when you don't read and just play by hear you seem to repeat yourself over again and not even realise you are doing it sometimes. i have done it many times on compositions. when this happens i usually scrap my idea and move on to something different. But i can understand why hans (since not writing much on paper) occasionally sounds repetitive on several of his scores. Hans is an extremely talented composer who has redefined filmed music to a certain extent bout often feels like you have heard this before, and up and coming composers who imitate him because this is what filmmakers want now


MacArthur2013-12-22 18:53:56
And The Problem with the modern film music is...?

Hey, if a director wants film music this way then great a lot of the films today a Jerry Goldsmith or John Williams score wouldn't work. simply because of the darker element in the films Zimmer brings that whereas Williams or Goldsmith don't.


maximus2013-12-22 19:03:44
That is an absurd thing to say. how can you say goldsmith and williams don't bring darker elements to the table? The only thing zimmer does to bring these darker elements is compose an atmospheric sound. not much music required. just a very long deep note, which zimmer does often and quite good but not revolutionary. but saying that williams and goldsmith didn't is just plain blah blah.


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-22 19:05:15
MOS is absolutely fantastic, and if some narrowminded person has not the ability to understand it, TOO BAD !


maximus2013-12-22 19:10:00
Hybrid, its the narrow-minded that think they understand it. There are a couple of decent cues. but the action ones are just meh and would be described as static noise. i understand why you would big hans up, and why wouldn't you, this is a site dedicated to hans zimmers work.


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-22 19:24:48
Yes I'm narrow-minded, but contrary to others, I'm not trying to hide it in the name of the illusion of "objectivity".


MOS is great, DOT.


...2013-12-22 20:00:59
Lol I am sitting here wondering why some users just can't let people listen to te music that they enjoy the most.

Zimmer, Goldsmith, Williams, Powell, Korngold... whatever...



Joshua2013-12-22 20:50:17
Agghhhh I'm so fucking sick and tired of people who think just cuz you write on a piece of paper opposed to a digital sequencer you are a infinitely superior composer. That in itself is the definition of narrow mindedness. Damn near every major working composer today writes digitally. That's just the nature of the beast in the industry today.


Mortifer V.2013-12-22 23:34:19
If You Love These People DAMMIT!

I can see why some may consider the action cues from MoS mediocre or bad, but I can listen to "If You Love These People" all day, all week and not get tired of it. It works for me so well... it's just so short... This and the final 8 or 4 minutes of the Sketchbook.


thejok3rrules2013-12-23 01:23:22
''If you love those people'' is such a pretentious and arrogant action cue...


Edmund Meinerts2013-12-23 02:11:49
It's pretentious, Maximus, to assume that a composer who writes on paper is intrinsically superior to a composer who writes on a computer.

It's equally pretentious, Hybrid, to claim that a certain score is amazing and that anyone who disagrees doesn't "get it."

It's completely ridiculous, MacArthur, to suggest that Goldsmith and Williams are incapable of writing dark music. Dude...have you not heard The Omen?!


Mortifer V.2013-12-23 02:47:08
no, @thejok3rrules, it's not pretentious and it's definitely not arrogant. but it all comes down to personal preference in the end...


thejok3rrules2013-12-23 04:00:57
It is... The best track is definitely ''Goodbye my Son'', but I'M holding my point: ''If you love these people'' is an arrogant piece of music.


Areozz2013-12-23 04:22:38
Dafuq does that mean? What does it mean to say that a piece of music is pretentious and arrogant? For fuck's sake, it's music! Next we're going to start personifying music even more; not saying that the music evokes a feeling of sadness in the listener but rather the music itself feels sad!

I can't say I've ever seen Mortifer on here, but I have to agree with him. It does all come down to personal preference, as do a lot of things in life. What people here seem incapable of grasping is that opinions are opinions and facts are facts. Opinions are not facts and facts cannot be opinions. Does this make sense?

I guess maybe not everyone had a chance to take some sort of upper level English class (or an equivalent class in countries where English isn't the primary language).


Mike2013-12-23 04:27:59
Edmund and Areozz have summed up my view quite well.


MacArthur2013-12-23 06:19:00
I know the Omen It's more scary than dark here's what I was trying to say...Zimmer brings that Dark hero to the table in a way that I don't think Goldsmith or Williams could or can.

If that makes sense


Edmund Meinerts2013-12-23 06:42:40
Scary =/= dark? Huh?

I'm sorry, but just what exactly of Goldsmith's have you heard? Because the man has written a plethora of very dark, brutal scores. The original Planet of the Apes, for example. Oh no, wait, that would be too "weird" for your sensitive ears, eh MacArthur? Because the only form of "dark" music you're willing to accept is Zimmer's endless D-minor droning? Give me a freaking break.


Ds2013-12-23 08:27:54
Maximus: how do you explain the similarities between several scores by John Williams? Since he writes on paper, i thought it was impossible for him to repeat himself...

thejok3rrules: how is "If You Love These People" arrogant?? What does that even mean? To me it's the best track out of MOS, really majestic, a perfect climax for an epic movie, violent and beautiful... And it brought back the vibe of some old HZ scores.

Edmund: yeah there's definitely a big difference between "dark" and "scary", for once i get what MacArthur is meaning. The Dark Knight is a very dark score, it's slow, deep and has a filthy atmosphere. John Williams scores aren't dark but they can be scary. They are filled with orchestra madness, swirling in all directions to frighten you.


trent easton navarro2013-12-23 10:08:51
And Macarthur proves once again he has no idea what he's talking about. You really think highly skilled composers like Goldsmith (who was without a doubt one of the most creative composers around) and Williams couldn't write dark music?

If you look past the usual suspects, there are plenty of scores where Williams shows a darker side. Same with Goldsmith.

A talented composer can compose all types of music and there is no denying the talents of Goldsmith and Williams. As enjoyable as his Batman scores are, Zimmer didn't deliver anything groundbreaking.


thejok3rrules2013-12-23 17:46:02
Whatever, what I'm trying to say is that Zimmer is starting to lose his touch... Composers such as John Powell, Henry Jackman and Matthew Margesson do create something new, while Zimmer repeats himself from past years. Other composers do the same, but Zimmer over-doing it.


thejok3rrules2013-12-23 17:47:09
**is over-doing it**


MacArthur2013-12-23 18:01:03
Zimmer Hasen't done anything groundbreaking? WTH!


MacArthur2013-12-23 18:02:22
@ Thank you Ds. That's what I was trying to say.


trent easton navarro2013-12-23 18:25:59
@macarthur Zimmer surely is a talented composer but what did with the batman scores isn't groundbreaking. With the exception of The Dark Knight they are actually kinda boring outside of the film.


MacArthur2013-12-23 18:47:08
Um...Let's see POTC scores, Crimson Tide was a Breakthrough score. Gladiator. Rain Man. Do I really need to continue.


Mike2013-12-23 18:49:21
MacArthur, he's not saying Zimmer has NEVER done a breakthrough score, he's saying Zimmer's BATMAN isn't groundbreaking. ;)


MacArthur2013-12-23 18:55:06
It didn't sound like that. But ok he's entitled to his own opinion. I think Dark Knight was Groundbreaking. and I know a lot of other people do as well.


trent easton navarro2013-12-23 20:38:51
I think you need to re-read what I wrote macarthur. Nowhere did I imply Zimmer hasn't written anything goundbreaking. Indeed Rain man and Crimson Tide, but also Black Rain. Zimmer basically reinvented action scoring. As for Pirates, you are confusing popularity with groundbreaking. Like Batman, they aren't. The Pirates score are a continuation of Zimmer's 90s action sound(they play like a Zimmers greatest hits) and Jack Sparrows theme is a copy of Ed Shearmurs Count of Monte Christo


MacArthur2013-12-23 21:39:19
I think you need to re-read what I said. I said Dark hero, That could imply Superman The Character's from Crimson tide,

And Let me ask you this was Raiders of the Lost ark Groundbreaking?


Maximus2013-12-23 21:48:01
@Ds about the similarities. I didn't really make myself quite clear on what I meant about repeating selfs work. Sure Williams has similarities in scores he has written, but when he does a score he doesn't just make a couple of themes and repeats them through the same score. Every cue most of the time is cometely different and written for that moment to create the emotion that is showing on screen. Zimmer uses his themes over and over again.

@Edmund I didn't say a composer who writes on paper is far superior to one who doesn't. Writing music on paper helps you create something different each time. Take for instance you have just thought of a tune in your head, it's amazing what you have just thought of, if you don't write it down you loose it. It's the same for authors. I cannot right music but when I play I seem to come across the same notes subconsciously. Like I said you don't even know your doing it sometimes. But writing on is so so helpful. You can do so much more to your compositions. Do you think zimmer could actually write a piece of music equivalent to Williams, goldsmith, shore and I'm gonna say it.....Powell (who has flourished into such an interesting composer)....no, because writing capabilities are limited.


Edmund Meinerts2013-12-23 22:45:23
Raiders is groundbreaking in the sense that Williams managed to create a theme that doesn't just stand for Indiana Jones, but has come to be the ultimate music of adventure in the public consciousness. You could arguably put that down to the films' popularity, but there are plenty of very popular films that we don't remember any music from and that theme from Raiders is instantly memorable in a way that very, very few others are.

I'd actually agree with you that Zimmer's Batman scores are pretty groundbreaking, in that not a lot of film music before it sounded like that. But they're not scores I find particularly moving or even all that interesting. I've always been of the opinion anyways that originality is much less important than effectiveness, so I'd much rather listen to the fun Pirates scores being best-of-Zimmer compilations than the Batman scores being all broody and drony and overly serious.


Joshua2013-12-23 22:54:51
So Maximus your basically saying that YOU cant take whats in your head and turn it into something wonderful because you tend to repeat phrases when you play? So by default someone of Zimmers caliber cant either? Thats just plain ignorance man! You shouldn't criticize someones craft when you yourself just said you cant write music. And oh yeah just a heads up, Powell does write digitally hell even Shore does! You can see an M Audio keyboard and computer in his writing studio in his behind the scenes videos.


MacArthur2013-12-23 23:06:52
I believe the new Hobbit score is written digitally & yes Zimmer also writes on paper Prince of Egypt & The Pacific. were performed by an orchestra. usually indicating some written down work.


trent easton navarro2013-12-23 23:15:36
Macarthur what the hell are you talking about? Dark heroes? Superman? Crimson Tide? How is that reaction to what i've said about groundbreaking scores?


Joshua2013-12-23 23:19:50
Now im not saying Shore writes everything digitally cuz he doesnt, he does write a lot in the traditional way. But he does use digital sequencers occasionally and why not? Its a tool, use it!


Maximus2013-12-23 23:39:01
Joshua, there you go jumping to conclusions. I in no way was saying anything against digital music. And all I said that writing music is more helpful. I for one wish I could write on paper then if could easily flourish my ideas. Don't put words in peoples mouth. And if I criticised then it's for good reasons, you have to take a little critique to improve ones work! You sound like if took and bit of it your arrogance would blissfully explode! My and shore have something in common then we both own an m audio keyboard ;)


Ds2013-12-23 23:42:36
Joshua is spot on, maximus' argumentation is bullshit. It's solely based on his own abilities to (not) write music. Your mind can't do that, but surely Hans' can.

Regarding what Maximus said, really, i don't agree. Just listen to "At World's End". Hoist The Colours, Singapore, At Wit's End, Multiple Jacks, Up Is Down, I See Dead People in Boats, Parlay, Calypso, One Day, I Don't Think Now's The Best Time.... they are all very, very different tracks. They are absolutely NOT a theme repeated over and over again. Each track is specific to the scene it was written for.


Edmund Meinerts2013-12-23 23:56:49
Ds, you're picking one of Zimmer's most diverse and thematically complex scores (and, IMO, his best). And it's also one of his scores with the most synchronization points, i.e. writing to scene. The Batman scores (and a lot of his recent work) have a LOT less of that; music is not written to scene as its own piece, but rather edited to it from the suites that Zimmer provides. Which is why in a lot of his recent scores I feel like they don't always sit perfectly on top of the image. It's like buying a suit off the rack rather than having one tailored to you; sure, it still fits more or less, but it doesn't feel quite right.

But certainly I don't think I've ever heard a Zimmer score that can be described as "the same theme over and over." The closest thing he has to that would be Crimson Tide, and even that has quite a bit of diversity.


Joshua2013-12-24 00:48:40
Maximus first off, you gotta work on your english dude lol Secondly you literally just said and i quote " and all I said that writing music is more helpful" How the fuck do you know its more helpful if you cant do it?!

Definition-
Ignorance: lack of knowledge or information.



Maximus2013-12-24 01:44:57
Joshua, thanks for the little bit of education there. My English does need improving but I would say it's ok for someone who's first language is Spanish.
You don't need to get all aggressive by swearing. I can tell you are either quite young or a very immature person to talk the way you do.

I know very well that if i could write music on paper I would be far better than I am now. It would be plain stupid of me to not think that. It's like speaking my English, I wouldn't get far if I couldn't write it, like you pointed out I do indeed need to work on my English


Joshua2013-12-24 02:05:38
I am neither young or consider myself immature. I just get a little heated when ignorant folks such as yourself come off as the messiah of music. Music is an art form, there is no right or wrong way to do things. So i find it ridiculous when punks like you only offer negative opinions on other peoples crafts that work just fine for them. And yes "You sound like if took and bit of it your arrogance would blissfully explode" work on your fucking English! Pardon my French ;)


Russel2013-12-24 04:09:19
Does anyone physically own the Disc? Mine cuts off at places and that pisses me off a lot.


MacArthur2013-12-24 05:23:01
Trent what I was saying is that Zimmer's Crimson Tide score is groundbreaking. among others. So Bug off.

Cause you are really the one who doesn't know what he is talking about. Batman scores were groundbreaking and I know a lot of people who love the Batman scores. so it's all a matter of opinion


Maximus2013-12-24 11:14:30
Joshua I am a very calm and relaxed person so I'm not going to lower myself by saying things about you cause I'm not like that. The internet is a very easy place to say whatever you want about someone, so I understand why you would say things. However I'm going to take your criticism into hand because I know very well I need to improve my English. I'm pretty sure though you have criticised someone's work before as everyone on here. But the problem here is that most think zimmer can do nothing bad. I'm a huge zimmer fan but at least I know when he is capable of more.


NM2013-12-24 13:25:25
I actually 'get' where Maximus is coming from, as an aspiring amateur composer. It's not about whether you write digitally or on paper, no, that really makes no difference to the ideas you come up with. But having a real understanding of, and appreciation of music theory does indeed help your compositions, there is no two questions about it.

I'm sure we have all seen the 'academic' types who learn how to write music through simply learning the 'rules' of music, piecing their compositions together through those rules, and the result is often 'technically correct' but quite soulless and unengaging - a bit like someone who learns a second language in school. Knowing the rules of a language doesn't mean you know how to *actually* speak it. A child learns how to speak a language long before they actually know any of the rules or syntax - that intuitive sense of a language is probably the most important thing you can have.

But that doesn't mean the child doesn't learn those rules. Learning those rules makes the child better able to express the ideas in their head, to explain their ideas to others and eventually allows the person to break the rules! There are many ways of learning the rules as well, by speaking, by listening, by reading, but they all come down to making yourself part of the language experience. Is it any wonder that many of our best authors, playwrights and poets were masters of their tongue?

And just like competent authors and poets don't sit there and deconstruct every line of their work to the point of pointlessness (that is reserved for English classes), nor do good composers. I've found personally that music theory has not limited my work at all, it allows me to better put together what I hear in my head, as Maximus was getting at. I still don't tend to write on paper, because I'm more comfortable with my DAW, but that bit is irrelevant.

I sometimes see here and other places, that music theory is brushed aside as something reserved for ivory tower occupants, that 'doesn't matter'. But it *DOES* matter. Every single successful film composer working today has a good understanding of music theory and Zimmer included. I'm not going to argue on the degree of understanding or whatever, but it cannot be so easily dismissed. If you want to see the results of upcoming composers who think it doesn't matter, go on youtube and listening to endless stream of talentless Zimmer clones who think that writing broad french horn progressions, drum loops and 'Time' rip offs makes them a good composer. They are every bit as poor as the JW clones who think that because they know a little bit about theory they can actually write music.


Mike2013-12-24 15:50:40
*applauds NM*


MacArthur2013-12-24 16:50:44
Well said!


Maximus2013-12-24 18:16:39
@NM
That's the way I was trying to put it. Glad someone actually jumped as it was getting frustrating and thanks!

Buffy The Vampire Slayer Sometimes reply Replies: 2 || 2013-12-13 17:59:25
Okay, I'm really new to this, so forgive my naivety, but what is this? Is it another album release?


Hybrid Soldier2013-12-13 18:09:05
It's a promo that was distributed to Academy voters...


You can listen to it here => foxsearchlight.com/fyc/film/12-years-a-slave/soundtrack/


Buffy The Vampire Slayer Sometimes2013-12-13 19:40:08
Oh, alright, thanks Hybrid!

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12 Years A Slave (Complete Score) soundtrack - Hans Zimmer 2013